00:00

think about how infidelity kind of starts and happens. We’ve had this conversation many times, especially now in the age of technology, a lot of it is happening through apps, through social media and messenger, through texting. So if that can happen with your partner or your spouse not knowing behind your back, why do you think, and this is rhetorical, but why do you think that your kids can’t be doing stuff behind your back too on these apps? It’s like you would want to have them on these apps when they’re at

00:29

mature enough age to understand like everyone who reaches out to you is not a friend. Everyone who reaches out to you is not who they say they are.  Welcome back to the Shirley Show.  I am your host Shirley.  Our discussions are going to be ranging from personal life experiences,  infidelity, trust, forgiveness, sex, heartbreak, self love, and so much more.  Let’s dive in,  pull up a seat,  make sure you’re cozy,  and get ready to be challenged and encouraged.

00:59

while you learn with me, your virtual girlfriend.  Welcome back to another episode of Shirley’s show. So today we’re going to be talking about parenting in the age of TikTok. Talking about raising kids while  balancing modern challenges like technology, soci-o-o-o-o uh

01:28

societal pressures and setting healthy boundaries.

01:33

You got it. huh. So, Kira’s going to begin our conversation. Kira, I’m going to pass you the mic. That was so cute. I’m like, yeah, you got it. You got it? No, you didn’t have it. It’s okay. societal pressures. Yeah. So basically, we’re going to chit chat today about TikTok and social media and how to set boundaries and healthy boundaries with our kids. And I have notes, so I’ll obviously be going back and forth.

02:02

But one thing I was thinking about was, like when we were kids, we’re both millennials and you’re a little bit older than me, but we’re the same  generation. Like I remember having a closet full of VHS tapes. And I remember when my parents would be like, oh, pop that in so we can record this show. Like, did you guys do that? We didn’t record stuff off of the TV or? No, but we had VHS, but we didn’t record. You had VHS tapes.

02:31

We were, remember being in my bedroom like when the song came on the radio and having a cassette tape and like pressing it right at the right moment so you could record the music. Did you do that? Shirley, what? I didn’t do that. I didn’t do that. Oh my God. I didn’t do that. Oh, so that’s how you would like record a song. And what would you do with the cassette tape? Play it anywhere you go? You would play it in your little tape deck, your little, um.

02:56

Now I can’t think of what the portable one that you carry with the headphones. know what you’re talking about. I don’t know, you never made your own cassette tape? No. Oh my God. No, I didn’t even have. know exactly what are those called? Whatever they’re called. think of it. I want to say a Walkman. What is that? No, that’s not the Walkman. Let me see. There’s a CD player. I had a CD player one and then I had a cassette tape one. Cassette tape player name.

03:26

What were those? I can’t believe you didn’t do that. So I remember like having a very vivid memory of… It’s just a cassette tape recorder. Yeah, like, but I feel like it had a, like there was a brand name for it. Well, they had like the Boombox,  Jensen, Cassette Player, Tomachi. So I guess maybe there was a name thrown out there, but I don’t remember. I don’t remember, but I have a vivid memory  of being in my room.

03:55

and I was waiting for them to play Usher Confessions album. That? I  thought she was maybe about to say something a little  older, like who? No, Shirley, listen. Like a Dina Howard? No,  it was specifically this album because my parents wouldn’t let me listen to it, remember? I was brought up very strict, right? I know. So I remember like, okay, the radio said they’re gonna play this and I got up.

04:24

press play on my cassette tape so I can like, you know, I feel like we had to work for stuff. Even like texting, remember it was like, you had to press the button like three times to get one letter or depending on what you were trying to spell. You remember that. It was similar to cat crew. Yes. When we first started texting. Yes. It was similar to cat crew. Exactly like that. No emojis. Just hella like, and even now I’m like,

04:53

ah on the TV, like if you’re trying to log into something and you have to like press each letter, I’m like, oh my god, this doesn’t have a QR code. Like I get so impatient about it. Yeah, I’m the same. all of that just made me think about how I felt like we had to work a little bit harder to get to entertainment and now it’s like literally in our pocket. It is. It’s easily accessible. Oh, it’s so accessible. I remember when Disney Plus added  ads.

05:21

Okay, my son is seven. He is used to instantaneous shows, like streaming, watching whatever he wants. And he’s like freaking out, like, what is this? What is this on the TV? You know, like not understanding. I’m like, oh, it’s an ad. And he’s like, well, why is it there? And I’m like,  and I was like, oh my God, you don’t even know what a commercial is.  Oh, so he doesn’t know anything about commercials. I guess you guys didn’t have cable at first. No, no, no, no, no. We’ve always had streaming.

05:51

uh I have like YouTube TV, but  he didn’t really watch that. ah He was only watching like his kiddie profiles on like Netflix or Disney Plus. And then Disney Plus switched their subscription plan at one point where for that tier we were on, they added ads. They never had ads before.  So he wasn’t used to watching ads or commercials when I’m like, that’s literally all we did.

06:19

there was no, you weren’t able to skip ads. Like, you understand what I’m saying? I do know what you’re saying, but I see what our kids, so I always have to remember there’s a 10 year, 10 and 11 year difference between our children. Yes, my kid is little and he’s grown up with.  Yes, with Netflix. Our kids didn’t grow up with  Netflix and Hulu. We didn’t get those subscriptions. I think they were  maybe 10 and 11 at the time when we got the subscription. So they knew cable.

06:49

And Comcast always had commercials. they commercials,  know, ads wasn’t anything new to them when  we got Netflix and Hulu. That’s why I’m like, this boy’s  out over ads. But you have to remember  specifically, think about it,  Netflix, we can just go off Netflix before. Netflix doesn’t have ads or didn’t have ads, right? So  if he wants to watch a show, he’ll watch his show, plays all the way through, he goes to the next show. um And I was just thinking like, dang.

07:17

We literally had to work harder. And then my kid, who’s seven, has everything instantaneous, instant access. The  phone, he can ask me for the phone and watch whatever.  It’s so wild. And I was thinking, he’s already recognizing um social media trends. Just from what he’ll hear on my phone, if I’m on TikTok or being at school, he’s repeating these…

07:48

You’re not a TikTok girl, are you? I have it because of my family, but I don’t post on Yeah, I don’t post. I just lurk. Okay. But there was this sound that was like, oh no, oh no, oh no, no, no, no, no. I don’t know that one. You would know it if you were on TikTok. Zaire was like repeating that for like weeks. Oh. So I just thought it was really crazy how…

08:17

He’s kind of like a sponge, like soaking everything up, but also wanting to make sure I don’t overexpose him to screen time and like setting good boundaries with that because our kids do have a pretty big age gap. Like how do you set the boundaries for your kids with social media or with TikTok? Like your kids are older. And when it did come and start introducing, I guess, how old were they?

08:45

when it kind of started and like, how did you navigate, you know, setting the boundaries with the screen time? That’s a good question. And now that I think about it closer and closer, I don’t really think we ever set boundaries with screen time when it came to our children. So they were, I’m trying to think when they got their first, I think everything happened somewhere around nine, 10, 11 is when they got their first cell phone.

09:13

because I think she was in seventh grade. Because at the time we really didn’t feel like they needed a cell phone because we dropped them off at school, we picked them up at school, we always know what family member they were at.  So we did give them a cell phone, I wanna say seventh grade was I think when, I wanna say maybe like 10 and 11.

09:36

because they had the cell phone a few years before my daughter was 14 and she kind of started staying home by herself with her brother. They already had the phones, but they were very basic. I was gonna say, was it a smartphone or was it just like a basic like, call and text phone? plan. Like all they really did was  they had it so their parents could access them. But there was not much going on on the phone because they had tablets.

10:06

So they would play like games and stuff off the tablet and the phone was really for us to contact them. And then that kind of shifted a little bit. But now that you say it, I never really was strict about setting phone time or  they call it screen time.  With the children, I really wasn’t. Now we did implement  disciplinary issues when certain things happen.

10:34

Like my daughter was being a bully at school, so we turned off the internet  on her phone. And all she was able to do was make phone calls and texts and that’s it. You know, but she, she still had access to like being able to watch TV, but she wasn’t able to go on the internet on her phone.  And that was for three months. And then there was an issue where my son is a gamer.  So with the gaming system,

11:03

when he was a little younger, we would implement disciplinary issues. Like one time he got so pissed off and he caught himself off guard. He said, what the fuck, mom?  Three months, but he started crying. He felt so bad. Like he was so into the moment of what he was doing playing that game. He didn’t even…

11:26

It caught him off guard. started crying and he apologized, but I was like, he’s still getting your three months. So three months no cane. That’s it. I already said it. So that’s it. know, and  that’s it. So when disciplinary actions needed to happen, we implemented with their devices, with the screen time, with the internet. Yeah. I understand. I’m also wondering if, do you feel like you didn’t really know like

11:54

internet safety in that sense back then, like we are hearing about it now about how like unsafe internet can be for kids. Do you think that if you had known like how unsafe it could be, you would have put more restrictions on it or you just kind of felt like they were older, you didn’t really think you needed to, or you had talked to them enough about it? Okay, so to answer your question, no. When it comes to internet safety, I’m one of those parents where like,

12:23

I feel like this world has always been unsafe, regardless what generation you are from. Baby boomers, millennials, now gen Zs.  And then what’s the new one now? Alpha A? I don’t even know. don’t know. Something like that.  I’m like, what?  Yeah, I it’s something alpha. Yeah, there’s something after the gen Zs, but I’m not quite sure what it is. But  I was never worried about my kids with internet safety.  You also have to remember,

12:52

Kaleef and I kept a good, healthy chokehold on our kids. We always knew where they were.  There was no surprises for us. We dropped them off at school, we picked them up from school. So between that, what,  eight and two, we knew where they were. Then after school, they were home. And then if we took them to a family member’s house, we knew what family member they were in.  And  they were already at an age when they started using devices where they can speak.

13:20

So I was never necessarily worried about the family member they were going to. oh And if there was an issue, they would present it to us and there never was an issue. So when it comes to the internet safety, I was never necessarily worried. There was a point in time  on the gaming system, because you know that gaming system, it’s opened up to  everybody on the  and you don’t know who you’re talking to. You can be talking to a grown man. So when my son,

13:49

really started to get into the games and then we got him like, it’s called like a Microsoft subscription where you’re able to go online. I can’t really explain it because I’m not in the gaming world.  That’s when a little sense of fear started to set in. He has a very good friend now that he actually met on the gaming system. And I remember when he first told

14:13

I was like, who is this kid? Where did you meet him? You met him online?  He was like, yeah, mommy, I want to go to his house. He gave me his address. This is his house. I was like, this don’t seem safe. And I’m not really too comfortable with this. And I think a year went by before the interaction finally took place between them. And when I met mom, I even told mom, I said, look, I don’t know who this boy is and why he wants And tell him not to be giving his address out. Like, They were, so that was the only moment.

14:41

that I was a little frightened about internet safety, that moment, and then when I would hear conversations, I’d be like, who are you talking to? You know, and he’d tell me. So it was only that moment I was a little worried because he was still young. He was like 12, 13, 14. So I was like, I don’t want anybody taking advantage of him. But it all worked out. Now they’re like really, really good friends and he’s going to his house next weekend. So that’s why I’m like,

15:11

Anything negative can be turned into a positive and anything positive can be turned into a negative. I try to be as not too crazy of a parent because sometimes when I think back about some of the things I took part in and we don’t need to share it here, I’ll be like, I could have been dead. Oh, our angels were working so hard. My angel was working hella hard for me. Like, yeah, what are you doing? Yes. Yes.

15:40

But it was a different, it was also a different time. That doesn’t mean that we weren’t putting ourselves in dangerous situations, but it was a different time. time, we like to use that a lot. It was a different error. But when you say different time, what do you think about Nyahid? Because when I think a different time, when people use that word like, oh, the seventies were so much safer. Really? Ted Bundy was I was going to say they just weren’t getting caught. They just weren’t getting caught. No, it was a different type of violence then.

16:10

I just think there was.

16:15

It was a different time, there was more trust. Like I remember coming home from school and me and my friends would meet up and we would go for bike rides for hours, like ride our bikes for hours. And our parents were okay with it. We didn’t have cell phones. There was no way to check in.  I mean, if there was an emergency, I guess we could use a pay phone or like go to someone’s house. like  we were…

16:42

surely riding our bikes around for hours. I would never let Zaire do that today.  So I think it was just, there was just a different trust. And I also feel like when you know better, you do better.  So I also think now, you know,  that doesn’t mean like child abductions weren’t happening then, or like bad things to kids weren’t happening then, but I don’t know.  I wouldn’t let my kid ride his bike for hours the way my parents let us do that.

17:10

We were always safe. Like we never had issues and I think we were in a group. So, but no.  And I am kind of a helicopter parent.  think part of that  is from  personal experiences. I think it’s also from  what I’m exposed to  when  with my work with the police department, what I volunteer. I think it also is influenced by

17:40

the work that Adrian does with Facebook and Meta and the things that he sees and how children are put in danger. And so I think we have a different sphere of influence, which makes us kind of like helicopter parents. I think too, like our kids are really exposed now, not like they were when we were kids. If you don’t want your kid on social media today, like at school, you have to fill out a form, you have to opt out. So there’s no pictures of them.

18:09

being posted like online or like in the yearbook. The thing is that’s not really guaranteed, right? Because at any kind of school function, a random parent could be taking a video, right? This parent posts a video online, your kid is in it. So  once it’s online, you know, that’s forever. The thing is, it’s like, there’s no way to be like a hundred percent.

18:38

not online or not having a digital footprint. I don’t think that’s realistic. But I do feel like now, because of all of the different apps and social media, again, that wasn’t something that we had when we were growing up, right? We were just playing outside, because that’s what we did. We were outside. Now, a lot of it is these kids are trying to be influencers at super young ages.

19:07

I mean, I think about, don’t, and see, this is the thing where I don’t know if you’ll know these people because your kids are older, but there was this little boy named Ryan who like, I think is like a multimillionaire now who started out on YouTube, a little kid that was just like playing with toys and opening toys and unboxing toys. He was little when he started doing that and his parents were recording him. So it’s like, I feel like kids want to have this like influencer lifestyle too. So they’re starting really early.

19:37

I think they feel like pressure to kind of be online too.  And right now the big thing for my son’s age, which I don’t even know how it’s a big thing because he’s only seven is like bro blocks. No, that’s been around for a while. I’ve heard that, but my kids weren’t too, they dabbled in it a little bit, but they weren’t too serious about it.

19:59

Yeah. And the problem  is that Adrian and I are not gamers. My husband and I are not gamers, right? Like, I don’t know the gaming world. I didn’t grow up playing video games. Like, that wasn’t something that was ever of interest to me, like ever. So  these games, like Roblox and Minecraft, we have to do all this research on to find out, like, is it safe? Like, and if it’s not  rated  for his age group, I usually will not let him play it.

20:28

We downloaded Roblox to just trying to get a feel of what it was. And I was just like, I’m not really feeling this. There’s too much  like access, even with parental controls, because a person,  an adult can pretend to be a child. And yes, again, because of like my sphere of influence and the things I see, I’m like, yeah, I’m not really, I’m not really feeling that. I don’t really know how to  navigate like.

20:57

allowing him to be on some of the apps or gaming sites while also setting a boundary like, Zaire, I don’t think you’re old enough for that yet, when all of his friends are playing on it. And then he feels left out, right? So it’s like, how do I make sure he’s safe but included? And then I have to learn how to play the game. it’s just like all these things.

21:21

So did you guys allow him to play or he’s still restricted from playing from the research you and Adrian did? No, he’s not playing Roblox. Okay. And what is the discomfort that you’re feeling? The discomfort is 100 % that I don’t understand it enough. Like I don’t know how to play it well enough to be able to do my checks and balances. I also- Do you feel as though-

21:49

What do you need to do checks and Because the reason I’m saying that is I’ve never did any checks and balances with my brother. So my brother was a gamer, but I was never a gamer. My son is a gamer, but I never did any checks and balances because number one, he was in the house. Number two, I can hear the conversation that is taking place.  And at any point, if I needed to restrict you, which I have in a few  instances, I did.  So what checks and balances are you trying to?

22:19

So for this particular game, and I will encompass like a lot of social media and apps in this uh description too.  But in the game, like there is a chat option  where someone can message him  and talk to him. I can turn it off, but they can also talk through the characters.  So while the content and how it looks and how they’re moving around may look normal, the things that

22:49

they may be saying or  the things that they’re doing may be more adult  or explicit. uh And because I’m not sitting next to him watching the whole thing, like usually I might be on my phone scrolling TikTok or reading a book. I’m not watching everything that I could, right? But also I don’t, I just, it’s not realistic for me to watch the whole entire like 30 minutes he’s playing.

23:19

Um,  I feel like there are  ways and loopholes that like child predators know how to like groom  and manipulate a child, even when they’re like pretending to be kids.  for me, it’s like not understanding the whole game itself and then being concerned that he’s being exposed to things that are beyond his age.

23:48

what he can comprehend, even if it’s just violence and not like anything sexual. And then I guess it’s also like not  knowing if someone is trying to talk to him,  if he’s going to respond. mean, we’ve taught him stranger danger, good touch, bad touch, but the online safety is something that we are talking to him more about so he understands that there are sometimes bad people behind the screen.

24:16

that you can’t see or they’re pretending to be kids. So it’s like, I don’t want to ban everything, right? Like I want to allow him space to experience it and like  know how to handle it and no one to tell us if something doesn’t feel right. But I’m just not 100 % comfortable on it because I just feel kind of a little illiterate when it comes to Roblox or Minecraft. And I also think those games were not created for seven year olds.

24:44

So he doesn’t really need to be on it yet. Literally, like, you know, these games have age.  What’s age game for Roblox? Let’s see. I want to say it’s 10. Let me see. Oh, it’s 10. So at what age will you feel more comfortable allowing him to play 10?

25:02

Uhhhh

25:06

I don’t know.

25:09

You guys haven’t crossed that bridge yet? I think Roblox is not, it’s saying nine. It’s saying nine? Okay. think, yeah.  I think we kind of have to take it one day at a time. And especially because these games change so quickly, surely. in two to three years, it could be something totally different out that he wants to play, you know? I just  want him  to be safe and I just think he  is…

25:39

a naive seven-year-old and very trusting of people. And I want to make sure I’m not exposing him to things that can put him in danger or that he can become hyper-focused and addicted to. Because that’s the other issue that I’m not so much worried about. Like if he plays Super Mario Brothers,  I’m fine with that, you know?  But I don’t want him to be… ah

26:07

addicted and that’s when we noticed we had to kind of pull back on the screen time because he was acting out when it was time to put it away. You know, like we’re not having a full meltdown because it’s time to put it away. So he has an hour, um, screen time when he gets home from school. Okay. Okay. So that encompasses everything that means he can be on his iPad playing games.

26:35

or being on his iPad watching  whatever shows he wants to watch. um If he wants to watch like YouTube kids, he has to watch it in the living room so we can see what he’s watching. So that encompasses all of that. He has one hour. Now you have to understand too, we get home around 4 p.m. He go to school late. So we get home at 4 p.m. He has an hour from four to five. I’m starting dinner, right? And then…

27:05

he has to get in the bath at 630. So it’s only like a two and a half hour window before he has to kind of start doing his bedtime routine.  So I definitely want him to have that time to like decompress however he wants. And so he does have the screen time. um But I guess it’s just like making sure I’m setting that clear boundary of like, this is how much you get  and that’s it. Like if your game is not finished too bad, you know you have an hour. But before we weren’t really…

27:34

putting a cap on the screen time. It was just like, oh, he can play until dinner’s ready or he can watch while we’re eating dinner. And then one night I was like, we were all sitting together at dinner. I was on my phone scrolling TikTok. Adrian was on his phone scrolling TikTok and then Zaire was on his iPad watching his. And I’m like, we’re not even eating together. We’re all on devices. So it’s also like setting a boundary of like, okay, we need to put this down and just have some  like family time.

28:04

But it’s hard because I do feel like the screens and the devices are kind of like the decompress time. I notice that I’m on it a lot when I get in the bed. That’s like when I’m decompressing, I notice it a lot like when I’m getting off the plane and we’re in the van to the hotel, I’m like scrolling TikTok, you know? And I realized too how addicting it can be. And that’s like my biggest concern also, like setting the boundary  and making sure like he’s not on

28:33

the computer and iPad too much and that we’re not on our phones too much. Like have your kids ever called you out for being on the phone like too much like mom put your phone down you’re always on your phone or. Yeah but they say it out of being funny and listening to what you’re saying is interesting because it’s always.  So about the time we may not have been restrictive but we did have like.

29:01

We were never restricted on how much time they were supposed to have, but when they were we started like that too. Yeah. When they were younger, and when I say younger, things only started changing, I think, within the last year, because they’re 16 and 17 now, about to be 17 and 18. So within the last year, things started changing. And in the beginning, when screen time started with their phone and their tablets,

29:28

Typically with me is by bedtime it had to go down so they can so they would have it literally every day after school But as long as schoolwork and stuff was done. Yeah So  as long as the schoolwork was done, they were allowed to get on their devices right up until bed and Have they checked me? Yes, they have I’m trying to think like so you’re definitely did and it made me feel bad for like two days two days

29:58

They have  checked me. I’m going to say, they checked me on devices? I can’t even remember. So it probably is not anything that really affected me. Yeah, it wasn’t significant enough for you to be like, all right, I need to chill.  No,  I’m one of those parents where like.

30:20

this parenting thing is so hard. And sometimes I just try like, I need to be on chill mode because at the end of the day, there’s going to be a point where like, you’re to be doing what you want to do anyway. And hopefully you implement these good values and yeah, these good values that I’ve set for you. But what truly is a good value? Because when I try to put myself and I’m one of those, I’m an extreme over thinker. I’m like, okay, okay.

30:49

Let me think about this for a minute. How often am I really on this phone for me to really be saying something to my kids? Because as soon as I have an opportunity, sometimes I’m on the phone, I’m on the phone for bed. I’m on the phone at times that I shouldn’t be on it. And then I’m like, who gonna check me? So  let Kaleef say something to me. I’m side eyeing him.  with the kids within the last year, I kind of got  lax a little bit about constantly checking them.

31:19

Like I said, the children are in the house. To me, that’s a safe zone.  And I was always listening out with my son. So the reason I say my son about the game, my daughter’s not a gamer. She was always on her phone. I wasn’t necessarily concerned.  And also for a long time, we would always take their phones and look to see who they were texting, is what they were doing. I think- That was what I was gonna ask you, Shirley. Yeah, cause don’t worry, I was getting to that, but yes.  So we would do that.

31:48

So like the phone was free range. whatever text message or phone calls they made, Kaleef and I had the ability to randomly pick up the phone and go through it. That happened for maybe like a year two or three. And it’s not like something we did on a weekly basis. It was very random and the kids knew that. Sporadic, yeah. Yes.  Very random and they knew that. So there were little things that we did.  I guess that you can say we did gate.

32:18

But we  tried to do it in moderation as much as we possibly can. And unless there was something that needed to be disciplined,  then that’s when screen time had to be scaled back a little bit.  So you do speak about using it  as like a punishment, like discipline, taking it away. Did you ever use it as a reward? Like, okay, you can have extra time or anything like that.  we never use screen time as a reward.

32:48

They just, they had it until it was a disciplinary action that needed to take place because we knew it was a precious possession for them. They were very much affected. They were more affected by their tablets or phones than they were watching actual TV. So we would take the tablet or phone away and then they can watch whatever they needed to watch on TV because they were stationed. was a program. You just had to watch it. what they’re doing. Exactly. And that’s it. So there were.

33:18

When we took screen time away, it was tablets and phones,  not TV. They could still watch TV and do whatever, know, whatever they wanted to watch, they could watch. That’s fine, because you’re just laying there. Right. And I can hear it. I can kind of  either see it. I think here’s the thing.  nowadays, there are so many different apps, right? Of course, we initially started this conversation talking about TikTok. I think TikTok is…

33:48

um One of those things where like you say, everything can have a positive and negative. You can turn a negative into a positive, a positive into a negative. um

33:58

I  was um with our PTO, like the PTA at school,  and they had this community event where  law enforcement was coming to explain all of the apps to the parents.  And I was like, this is so important. I wish every school just implemented something like this for parents, right? Because  I have a young kid.

34:27

People who like you have older kids about to get out of high school, kids in middle school. Surely there are so many apps out here. Like I cannot keep track of them all. Keep track of them all. They were showing us that there’s an app that looks like a calculator. So it looks like the calculator app on the phone, but it’s not a calculator app. It’s an app where you can text  and send photos. And then they, once the person reads it, they immediately disappear. Right?

34:57

If you’re looking at your kid’s phone, and I’m not saying you, I’m just saying a parent,  and you see an app that looks like a calculator, nine times out of 10, you’re not gonna click on that because it looks like a calculator. looks like a calculator. So they’re disguising apps. I think Snapchat was one of the first big ones where you could send pictures and they would disappear. By the time Snapchat came out, I  was over the apps. You was over the apps? Yeah, I can’t keep, it was like,

35:26

Instagram, Facebook. I think there was like, like Kik was a chatting app. it was like WhatsApp. There were so many things coming out. I was like, I can’t get on another app. Like, so I was never like a Snapchat girl, but I understood enough that like you could send photos  and once they were viewed, like they were deleted. um There have been situations where there are.

35:53

I would say middle school age children, between 12 and 14, who are talking to people online through these  apps, right? Through TikTok.  And they think that they’re talking to  people their age or they’re talking to someone older and they know that they’re older and they start grooming them or they start getting personal information from them. They get their address and then they do harm to them  in person.  And…

36:24

It’s like, no matter how much we try to helicopter and make sure our kids are safe, I just feel like there’s always gonna be this gray area where I’m gonna have to kind of go the extra mile to keep up, to know what all these apps are, to know how they work, to know how it’s influencing my kid, whether it’s body positivity or these viral trends that these kids do now. It’s just like, I have to know about all this stuff.

36:54

There was a trend happening, I think it was called like the Kool-Aid trend  where kids were running full speed into people’s wooden fences. Now, do you even know about this? Exactly, right? So I don’t know what the name of the trend was, but it was based off of a Kool-Aid commercial from probably the nineties. You remember the Kool-Aid  was like a big like jug.

37:23

the actual like Kool-Aid person.  Maybe like when you do this video, you can like have a picture of the little thing I’m talking about. But he was like a little jug and he had like a little face, like a big clear jug. know who Kool-Aid guy is. With the red juice, right? And so he busts through the fence in the commercial. And somehow that becomes a trend where teenagers, kids are all running full speed at the same time.

37:51

busting into people’s fences. So people would be waking up and like their whole fence would be down or looking at security cameras and seeing like five kids running full speed into their fence. Like it’s also, this is where I go back to like the values that we’re instilling into our kids, like kindness, empathy, respect. Like why would a teenager think that that was a smart thing to do? To damage someone’s property.

38:20

Like, do you know how much fences cost? Fences are expensive, but even you telling me about that, but I was one of them kids, like, I’m not doing nothing stupid like that. Exactly. children’s minds are young. I also think, like, part of that is because of how we were raised. Like, I would never do that either, Shirley, right? Like, I also think I had a healthy fear of my parents, too. I can’t say that’s how we were raised. There are some people I look at these days that are even millennials my age, and I’m like, you just not.

38:49

all with it. You’re dumb. Well, I’m talking about you and me. That’s what I’m talking about. I agree 100%. But do know what I’m saying? Like, I do understand what you mean. I don’t want my kid to look at, to be on social media, to be on TikTok and see this and be like, oh snap, that looks cool. I got to go do that with my friends. Like that’s hella dumb. And I hope that I would have taught him enough sense that he wouldn’t do something like that.

39:16

But that’s the kind of thing that I feel like social media and apps and games and TikTok can kind of influence. And that’s the part that I’m like worried about too. I am worried about those things. No, you are making sense. And it’s here. It’s interesting for you to hear you talk about your seven year old, because now I’m at a different level. I’m so past that stage. We’re at different level. it wasn’t your, your seven year old and eight year old.

39:45

They didn’t have this stuff when they were that age. So it’s like, I’m parenting in a different era and in an age of technology that’s completely different even from seven years ago. Like think about that, Shirley. And now when you think about it, I’m like, okay, now I have to track back. They weren’t allowed to have Instagram until they were 15.  See? So you  were being restrictive and you were trying to keep them safe because I feel like, Shirley, if we just think about, if we just split this, right? And we think about

40:15

how infidelity kind of starts and happens. We’ve had this conversation many times, especially now in the age of technology. A lot of it is happening through apps, through social media and messenger, through texting. So if that can happen with your partner or your spouse not knowing behind your back, why do you think, and this is rhetorical, but why do you think that your kids can’t be doing stuff behind your back too on these apps? It’s like you would want to have them on these apps when they’re at

40:44

mature enough age to understand like everyone who reaches out to you is not a friend everyone who reaches out to you is not who they say they are you know what I’m saying it’s like the same way you can cheat and do all those things on apps is the same way our kids can be involved with things that expose them to like real danger yep dangerous people yeah because you’re right now that I think about it they weren’t allowed to have

41:09

Snapchat and Instagram until they turned 15 and that year difference was always an issue because the little one wanted to and I said, no, you had to wait. And the reason she brought it up to me is because, mommy, Snapchat is musically, why can’t I get it? And I was like, I don’t care. You’re not getting it till you’re 15. So that’s why I, that’s the only reason why. you’re saying mommy, because I can totally hear it like that That’s what they call me. They call me mommy. Mommy, no, like, yeah.

41:36

So that’s why I know that. now that you say that, yeah, I did implement. When it came to social media, we did implement restrictions because it was 15 when they got Instagram. They don’t have Facebook. They don’t care about Facebook, but Instagram, TikTok, and Snapchat, they didn’t get them until they were 15.  So we did. are so many apps now. Yeah, there are a lot of apps.

42:01

There are, and I don’t know what they have and what they don’t. Because we don’t police as often now because our daughter’s about to be 18, she’s going off to college. Now the conversations have shifted more like don’t respond to the text messages you get about jobs because those are scams. If anybody tells you they to talk about a job with you on WhatsApp, don’t waste your time because no real institution or business

42:30

is going to reach out to you in that way. And then other things is like Amazon, Netflix, Hulu subscriptions. Granted, the kids are on our subscription and they’ll be on there for a while until probably they get their own place, move out, start their family. But I said, don’t click on every link. So now my conversations with them have shifted about be mindful of these emails that you receive. Every email is not a legit email.

42:59

when it comes to businesses, because there are scammers out there trying to get your information, your credit card information. So now our policing has shifted. But now when I say here and think about it, because I think it’s been a while, it hasn’t been that long, but it’s just I’m at a different stage in the game. And I had to think, okay, we didn’t allow them to have Instagram and all those till they were 15. Yes. And I wouldn’t even say it’s policing. It’s because you want your kids to be safe. It is. You don’t want them.

43:29

You don’t want them to get caught up. It’s policing. Policing is not a negative thing. That’s just like, let me tell you sidebar. Let me read what that definition is. you know people assume cult as the… Policing is not a bad thing. Even cult, I have to tell you a little story about cult. It says the maintenance of law and order by a police force or the enforcement. maintenance of law and order of mom and dad era. Call it what you

43:56

Enforcement of regulations or agreement. Okay. Yeah. So you could say it’s policing. Yes. I just feel like it has kind of a negative connotation and maybe that’s just me because I would definitely. You like helicopter. Yeah. I definitely wouldn’t say policing, but I wouldn’t and I wouldn’t, yeah, helicopter. Yeah, for sure. I’m a helicopter parent, but I feel like what you’re doing now is the same thing I’m doing is trying to keep our kids safe. Like, so they don’t get caught up in scams. It’s kind of where you’re at. And I’m like, I don’t want mine caught up in.

44:26

you know, being around a predator. Predatorial activity. Yeah. But go ahead. What were you going to say? feel like I About the cult, same thing. Negative connotation. Did you know that something as small as a yoga group can be considered as a cult if you look up what cult actually means? We automatically associate cult with like…

44:50

You know, the people who killed themselves with cyanide, I don’t know the different groups out there. You know, the Waco in Texas, that, all that thing, Johannesburg, all those. We think of cult in that way. But I was reading  something on Instagram and I want to get this guy’s book so I can read it more about cult and what exactly is the meaning of cult. He, you know, he gave that simple example. He says something as simple as a yoga group can be a cult.

45:18

if it’s looked at in an unhealthy way. you know, so that’s why I was like policing. Yeah, it’s mom and dad regulating what’s going on here in the home. Yeah. But we’re doing the same thing. We’re trying to like literally make sure our kids are safe. I think it’s like we have to teach our kids how to be in this tech world, you know, like building trust with them so they know that they can tell us about things.

45:45

but also making sure they know how to navigate it by like not clicking on these links that come through your phone or, you know, and it’s telling you, you got a package that’s coming and it’s, you know, just delete it, it as junk and yeah, it’s, it’s difficult. Cause I feel like it’s only going to get more complicated as technology advances. And like, we are just have to keep up. is going to be a very interesting world.

46:12

as advanced. just, it’s interesting to think what 10 years from now is going to look and what the advancements are going to be like with AI. Because especially with the conversation we had on the last episode, I don’t think it was on record, but about the meta glasses.  That’s new for me. Yeah, the meta glasses. have the Oculus too, which Zaire loves to play. What’s the Oculus? It’s like the VR. Oh, okay. Virtual reality. Why is it called Oculus and not VR?

46:42

Well, it’s the brand is called Oculus.  like, is this a new thing now? What is it advanced?  Yeah, no, no, no. It’s it’s it’s virtual reality, but it’s just like, it oh looks like goggles. You’ve seen it. I’ve seen I think I’ve seen. a picture here of the Oculus.  You’re so. Oh, she’s going to be like, we got to catch Shirley up.

47:06

You see, I’m trying to catch her up on all the things. You definitely, well, I knew about the VR. I didn’t know like now the new name is Oculus. No, it’s not I’ve seen this lady with these glasses on when she was dancing. And in my mind, I’m like, why is she wearing these things? What are they? Oh Shirley. You act like you’re a 60-year-old woman. Yes, Oculus is the brand by Facebook, like by Meta. But it’s just VR headphones or VR have Inside Loop. But I’m also a…

47:34

No, because I’m also a gadget girl. So I do like gadgets. You’re definitely more of a gadget girl. Yeah. than I am. And my gadgets and your gadgets are different. I’m more into mics and cameras and these types of things. And you’re like meta VR and like, you know, was talking to you about the ring. I watch.  Yeah. Well, I do have the watch. I have my watch. I do like that.

47:58

Yeah, so you know a little bit. I do know a little bit, but it’s really hard to keep up with all of them because you can get real caught up. And now I can understand now that I’m in my 40s, my grandkids might be like, Grandma, you don’t know about this? No, baby. They’re definitely going to say that because you didn’t know what Oculus was. Grandma don’t know nothing about this. is it? Mm-mm. I feel so old. I mean, the world is changing. It is changing fast.

48:26

It is, and it’s really can be a challenge to keep up.  It is, I have a lot more respect for the older generation now when like phones started to come out and that was like brand new to them. You got to remember, I got my first cell phone at 17. At that time, your parents are already in their thirties. Like, was this, what? Yeah, I got my first cell phone, I think I was like 16. Okay. But I had a…

48:53

You know what I had before I had a cell phone? Because the cell phones hadn’t really come out yet. I had the Motorola two-way pager. Do you remember this? Okay, I remember pagers. Yep. It was like the little, it was like the first pager that had a keyboard. What did you need that for? Who was paging you?  Me and my cousin. We both got one. So her mom got her one. My parents got me one. Oh, okay. she was in her school and I was in my school. We didn’t go to the same school. You know, we’re like best friends and we would just be like.

49:21

texting each other. Like, what are we talking about? Nothing. But it was cool to have. yeah, I can totally relate to understanding like, gosh, how our parents felt when all of that stuff started coming out. That’s how I feel now. I am a kind of a gadget girl, so I do kind of keep up on that, but I’m not a gamer. So that’s the part where I struggle with where, you know.  Yeah. The gaming industry is interesting. Now, if you want to take it from me, I didn’t learn anything. I don’t know how to do. Khalifa’s

49:51

Kaleep has dabbled into that world, but he’s not as into it as his son is.  So he understands a little more than  I do when it comes to the gaming world, but  I don’t think we ever, like, I can tell you I never learned how to do anything. I didn’t  know  nothing of what was going on. Even till this day, I still only know a little bit, and I’m okay with that.

50:18

That’s probably how I’ll be too, surely. I don’t see myself like,  learning how to play it. it’s just, it’s a lot and it’s a different world and it’s hard and it’s hard.  I’m not interested in that sense, but  I do defer to people who do play games. So I try to do that too. Like, Hey, what do you think about that you’re playing this? I think there was like an uh anime show he wanted to watch and I hadn’t watched it yet. And so I

50:44

I asked my sister’s boyfriend, because he was really into anime, and like, so what do you think about this show? Do you think this is appropriate? He was like, absolutely not. So I trusted him enough to be like, oh, yeah, he said that you shouldn’t watch this, so you’re not old enough, and it says that you need to be 10 anyway. That’s good. It’s going to be interesting watching you go through the stages, because there’s a huge gap between our kids’ age. Our kids, yeah. 10 years. So I’m 7 old, my son’s 7.

51:12

It’s about to be 17 next month. My daughter will be 18 in July. So it’s a big gap because he just turned seven in March. Yep. So it’ll be 10 and 11 year gaps. Yeah. Yeah. So it’s interesting to hear you say because when he’s my son’s age, then it’s going to be something else that I know Kira is going to be like, what do think about this? I’m like, oh, let me think back.

51:37

Right. But I  also, I mean,  I love the perspective and I love hearing, um especially from you, because I definitely think our parenting styles are similar, even though I helicopter a little bit more in the…

51:54

this  app tech  space because I have to, it was different, right? um But I definitely don’t want it to seem like it’s just about control. Like I want it to feel more like it’s about connection where he’s not consumed with the screens, like he’s still having human connection and like making friends and we’re not all on our devices at dinnertime not talking to each other, you know, like I want it.

52:23

I want him to make good choices when he’s online and, you know, that’s just, that’s the end goal. Like I want him to be safe, but I want to make sure I’m teaching him the right ways to be safe and the right things to do. Yeah, I agree. This is the hardest part about parenting when it comes to social media. And then when you say that too, I think the difference now is there’s phones, there’s tablets, because TV has been around for a while.

52:50

And that’s the screen time we mostly had. either had the TV or you go outside and play. That’s it. Nothing else in between. Now they have few options. They have their phone, they have the tablet. They do have in their pocket. It’s instantaneous. It’s accessible. wasn’t accessible for us. And parenting is an interesting challenge. And as I hear parents going through these stages, it’s very interesting because of course, Facebook had just came out when my…

53:20

kids were born came out in  well, oh four was when the world found out about Facebook. He had already had Facebook. We had it as college students. was just when Facebook first came out, you had to have a EDU email address to be on it. And then it opened up to the world in oh four, I think. And I joined Facebook in oh eight  is when I joined Facebook. And that was my first like,

53:50

little app about social media and that was interesting. And I look back, you ever look back to see some of the things you post and I was like, that was stupid. Why did I post like going to the store? This is not a diary.  I remember when Facebook, like the status had to say like, Kira  is, remember? Shirley is. was like- No, I don’t remember that. It might, I probably- That might’ve been early days before you were on.

54:18

I feel like 2008. I don’t remember but at one point like you couldn’t just write anything it had to say like here is Then that was that was after I do that was before I joined because I don’t remember that at all I don’t remember that see and you’ve known Facebook longer than I have I only mean covered it in oh eight and that was yeah a Meetup group I created through word-of-mouth somebody was telling me. Yeah, surely you should join and I joined because of that

54:44

And then I’m like, oh, I hate, not that I hate Facebook, but I’m just like, oh. But you know, do you hate social media? I don’t hate it, no. I think social media, I mean, this is probably a whole nother topic for another day, but I definitely feel like social media  can be a really good and positive tool. But I also feel like social media is a highlight reel and it’s not real. And I feel like  that part of it

55:14

people need to understand because if you don’t understand it as that, um you can kind of go down  a dark spiral of comparison and things like that. For me, I  don’t do social media in that sense except for like my personal business page um because I just don’t think it’s good for my mental health. I don’t think I can separate well that it is a highlight reel and then

55:44

leave social media from scrolling and feeling like, oh, I got everything together. I’m feeling good about myself. I don’t feel like that when I get off. I feel like, dang, I should be doing more or how come I’m not here?  I don’t always feel like great when I get off of it, but then I feel happy about seeing like people who are doing well and my friends. And so it’s kind of this like hard balance for me personally. And so that’s why I don’t participate in it.

56:14

Um, but I think it’s a really useful tool, especially like for my business, know, as a travel agent, like that’s how I get a lot of leads. That’s how I post information without having a website and things like that. So I definitely think it has its pros and cons. Definitely. Yeah. So for sure. It’s a great tool when it comes to businesses.

56:37

I definitely do not frown upon influencers. I think it’s a great avenue to make money because I’m all about 100 % multiple streams of income. Yep, I agree. The thing about social media  is um what I don’t like is social media, in my honest opinion,  is like you said, it’s a real that’s not real.

57:02

I like that term that you use because… It’s a highlight reel that’s not real. A lot of times I love to see the positivity that’s going on in people’s life. It is absolutely a great thing. It really is. But there are times I feel as though, and that’s one of the reasons why I created this podcast, so I can share on social media that behind the scenes, life is fucking hard. Real life Every day is not great.

57:31

I cannot sit here and post to you like, oh my God, look at my family and we’re going to church today or we just had an absolute fabulous dinner. But what you- were just arguing all the way in the car to church.  Exactly my point. Arguing in the car to church or you don’t realize when I walked into this house, I flipped the shit because shit was all over the place. Now I got to cook dinner for a family of three. Y’all don’t have no love or respect for me.

58:00

and y’all gonna eat this food that I cook not realizing the  tears and the stress I had to go through to make this. This is what I don’t like about social media is people only post the happy. But of course we don’t wanna be posting negativity all day, but I  wish people would have a little more healthy realism. Yeah, like transparency, vulnerability.

58:25

But here’s the problem with transparency. There’s also an unhealthy part of that because people feel as though like  their way is the right way and everyone else’s way is bullshit. Yeah. And also,  have you ever seen like when someone is being vulnerable or they are sharing, then they’re like, oh, this is not your diary. Like go tell that to a friend. I’m like, again, you guys just want the good stuff. You just want the highlights. You don’t want when people are trying to be vulnerable because then…

58:53

That’s an issue. that is that’s true. I honestly, take it in doses every now and then I’ll reactivate my page. It’s actually reactivated right now. Only because my sister had a baby and I wanted to see her pictures and make sure everyone was being respectful. You do that? like reactivate, activate, reactivate, activate? Yeah, because I also feel like it’s just kind of a way to check in and see like how people are doing that I’m thinking about if I don’t.

59:23

like have their personal number. For me personally, I think I have everyone’s number that I want to have  and can text them. ah But sometimes I feel like there’s people  who I don’t really want to text and I just want to be like, oh, I wonder how they’re doing. I don’t know. So I just will reactivate the page and peek You know, one of the things I did about social media, I think with social media, it’s about creating  boundaries that work for you. Number one,  I do not allow anybody to write on my

59:53

your wall, yeah. I closed that a long time ago because… Yeah, I think I did that also. And you can’t see my friend list. I have that on there too. That I don’t care so much about. But for me, these are boundaries I created for me. You can’t write on my wall um because you don’t need to. If I don’t really have your phone number, and I’m not saying it in a cold way, but everybody, like I told you, know, my friends group is  grouped into A, B, and C.

01:00:22

And if you’re not in the A group and you’re able to freely text me and check on me, I don’t need to hear about it on Facebook. So that’s one. Two things is I’ve removed my birthday from Facebook because a few years back  I was scrolling through the happy birthdays and quite a few people I’m like, are we still friends?  Oh, Facebook reminded you. And I felt like,

01:00:53

Do you even remember who I am? And there was one person I had to think like, fuck are you? yeah.  So I took my birthday down because I just didn’t want phony people texting me happy birthday. If in real life you know me, you gonna send me a text message and let me know it’s my birthday. And the people who are really close to me will send it. I don’t need everybody and their mama telling me happy birthday, but these are boundaries for me. Understand this, cause I know when people listen to this, oh, Shirley, you funny like that?

01:01:23

No, I’m not funny like that, but I don’t need somebody who I haven’t seen in 20 years telling me happy birthday. Like you good girl, you don’t have to say nothing to me. Yeah. these are two things I implemented that works very, very well for me. And I post whatever I want. And then when I post it, if you feel like commenting, you can comment. And then I’m always like…

01:01:49

Even now, I don’t necessarily filter my friends list because the people I’m friends with or the people I’m friends with, I’ll add everybody every now and then. But sometimes I look at people, I’m like, you got 4,000 friends? Yeah,  my friend list is blocked. Because at one point, people were friend requesting,  I don’t know, they were trying to, like, hook up or link up and messaging, like, women on my page. And I didn’t really like that. So then I  blocked it so you can’t even see the friend list.  Oh, no.

01:02:19

If I don’t know you or if Khalif doesn’t know you, because we kinda, he shares my Facebook. So if  I don’t know you or if he doesn’t know you, I don’t accept you. Because especially in this podcast world, sometimes people tend to try to find you. And especially sometimes I feel like what our job. So you can follow me and I’ll make public what I feel like making public. But don’t have that personal access to me.

01:02:45

Yeah, I think that’s appropriate. That’s one of the mental boundaries that I’ve created for myself. But I guess to end off today,  what is your word of advice you want to offer to parents out there who have young children? My kids are a little older, so I’ll share. You know, I feel like maybe you should start it off because you have a seven-year-old. You know, you’re closer to that one, two, three, four. Yeah.  I guess I would just say…

01:03:14

know, parenting in this tech age,  to  not forget about the connection, like the human connection with your child, not using  the technology as like a babysitter, making sure you’re teaching your child um to be safe, to be smart, to have empathy, to be kind to people. um

01:03:41

And just understanding that it’s always going to keep evolving and you have to be really intentional about keeping up. um I just, honestly, like for me, I would, just stay prayed up. just  try to be,  um,  well informed as much as I can  and just understanding that like, I’m not going to always get it right.  I can pull back a little bit to give him the space and opportunity to make some choices also.

01:04:11

Um, but right now at his age at seven, you know, my job is to make sure he’s safe. So that would be my last words. Gotcha.  And for me who has teenagers or I should say young,  approaching young, young adolescents. I would definitely say parenting is hard and there’s no right or wrong.

01:04:40

when it comes to  structuring  your household  in a way that works for you and your family.  You just have to do what you feel as though is best for your child. I don’t know what that is. Kira don’t know what that is.  And our methods  obviously may not work for you. You you may wait till your child is completely older before you provide a phone or tablet.

01:05:10

whatever your  circumstances may be.  The number one takeaway  is do the best that you can. Don’t overthink this parenting thing. Do the best that you know how to do with the tools that you freaking have. That’s one. Two,  try not to be too overbearing with your children. You want to create a loving, respectful relationship with your child.

01:05:38

Like Kira said, you don’t want to be  so controlling to the point where your child is suffocating and can’t breathe because remember,  God puts these  little human beings in our lives for approximately 18 years for us to guide, to look after, and  to teach them positive ways in this life. And we hope that they will embrace it when they get older.

01:06:08

at some point they’re gonna have to spread their wings. So you have to just do the best that you know how to do. So try not to be too overbearing.  three is failure’s okay when it comes to parenting. You are not gonna have it all together. And I know Kira did, you mentioned about the, ah you said about the,

01:06:36

parenting,  how did you phrase it? I totally forgot how she phrased it. But what I’m trying to say is that

01:06:45

by failure, mean, like, you are going to, there are days where you’re gonna be like, just go watch a little TV or just go do this or just go do that because you’re tired. And I get it, especially if you’re a working parent, even if you’re not a working parent and you’re stay at home mom and you have to see these little creatures all the time and this is what you do all day, every day. You need a break and trust me, it’s okay. It’s okay to be like.

01:07:10

Just go watch TV, just go do something or go hide in the closet. It’s all right. It’s all right, moms and dads. It’s totally okay because this life out here is hard. Yep. All right. So hopefully this episode was inspiring for you. And if you definitely have a comment, please share both negative and positive because Karen and can handle what y’all throw at us at the table here. Yeah. But till the next episode, everyone have a

01:07:39

Great one.  Thank you for tuning into the show. If you want to continue the conversation or share your takeaways  head on over to the website or join us on social media.  I want to hear from you.  Don’t forget to rate and subscribe to the podcast so you never miss an episode.  Chat with you soon.